The ultimate insult for rugby players: "Take up Ballet" Options

[bart]

I was fascinated by the following article, posted by dirac in today's LINKS section:

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard-spo...iers/article.do

If you don't like rough stuff take up ballet, says Boks coach de Villiers
Chris Jones Chris Jones
29.06.09

South Africa coach Peter de Villiers today told the Lions they should take up ballet if they couldn't handle the blood and thunder of rugby and accused them of being bad losers.

De Villiers spoke out just hours after disgraced flanker Schalk Burger was given an eight-w-ek ban for gouging Lions wing Luke Fitzgerald in Saturday's Second Test.

In an astonishing press conference at the Springboks Johannesburg HQ, De Villiers described Burger as "an honourable man" who would "never, ever" lower himself to eye gouging.

[ ... ]
"I have watched the TV footage and I am still convinced there is no way he went there on purpose. He never meant to go to anybody's eye. Rugby is a contact sport and so is dancing.

"So guys can go and make a decision. There were so many incidents in that game that we could say we want to cite this guy for maliciously jumping into another guys face with his shoulder.

"Why don't we do it? The reason we don't do it is because this game will always be a game to us.

"If we are going to win games in board rooms and in front of television cameras and in shops we must say to ourselves 'do we really respect this game that we really honour so much?'

"If it's the case that we are, why don't we all go to the nearest ballet shop, get some nice tutus and get a great dance going on. No eye gouging, no tackling, no nothing. Then enjoy. But in this game there will be collisions. There are no collisions in ballet.

The man seems to be slightly overwrought and a bit confused as to the point he is making. However, it seems like I've heard this kind of sneering use of "ballet" as a put-down before.

How do you suggest that a ballet-lover (or -- worse! -- a ballet dancer) respond to such a position? Reason? Rage? Sarcasm? Just ignoring it?

[sejacko]

As an expat South African, that is exactly the kind of ignorant remark one can expect from the uber-manly Rugby fraternity. (IMG:http://ballettalk.invisionzone.com/style_emoticons/default/wallbash.gif)

[carbro]

Boy, are they in for a rude awakening! (IMG:http://ballettalk.invisionzone.com/style_emoticons/default/speechless-smiley-003.gif)

[cubanmiamiboy]

How do you suggest that a ballet-lover (or -- worse! -- a ballet dancer) respond to such a position? Reason? Rage? Sarcasm? Just ignoring it?

Personally I've had some stupid questions/remarks thrown at me regarding ballet...
Honestly, I don't really care WHATSOEVER to clarify ANYTHING that borders stupidity...
I'm better off letting the subject's question rudely unanswered or clearly ignored. Believe me, they DO GET the message... (IMG:http://ballettalk.invisionzone.com/style_emoticons/default/devil.gif)
Or maybe a despective look can go with it...

[Ostrich]

I was fascinated by the following article, posted by dirac in today's LINKS section:

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard-spo...iers/article.do


....The man seems to be slightly overwrought and a bit confused as to the point he is making. However, it seems like I've heard this kind of sneering use of "ballet" as a put-down before.

How do you suggest that a ballet-lover (or -- worse! -- a ballet dancer) respond to such a position? Reason? Rage? Sarcasm? Just ignoring it?

I'm afraid this coach has been amusing the South African public for a while with his speeches. Sometimes he says something clever, but most of the time it is just confused, contradictory or even ludicrous.

As to how to deal with it, I think he should just be sent for a couple of ballet classes. In fact something like it was tried a while ago (it wasn't Springbok rugby players, unfortunately), and what the audience found most amusing was that the rugby players were quite unable to lift the petite ballerinas around.

[Nanarina]

(IMG:http://ballettalk.invisionzone.com/style_emoticons/default/angry.gif) These comments are typical of someone who has no idea of what being a Dancer requires. They are not only blinkered but insulting. It is a great pity how biased people can be about the art. But can be refrershing when a lay person who has not much knowledge of The Arts,finds to their surprise, what it entails,
aned comes to appreciate the enjoyment of seeing a live performance.

Returning to the question of sport versis dance, one should consider the beauty and vertiuosity of some of the Athletes, especially Gymnasts who participate in floor excercises to music and tumbling. Who possibly have taken Ballet classes to perfect their performances.

It makes me wonder what has happened to fair play, sportmanship, and winning without resorting to foulling the opponent. It not only happens in Rugby but also in Football at the highest level. In one sense it would do these people good to experience the disapline and routine a ballet class would give them.


And how then to a Dancer's response to this kind of ignorance, challenge them to do 32 turns, just laugh at them, or simply treat them with contempt, as they more than anyone know the phySical and artistic demands they have to endure.

[Dale]

It's the same sort of mentality that uses insults like, "You run like a girl" or "You do (some manly activity) like a girl." Anybody who's had a baby, had their period, or even undergone a waxing knows, you've got to be pretty tough to be a woman (IMG:http://ballettalk.invisionzone.com/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Yet the "bloody toes" aspect of ballet has been well publicized. It's kind of silly these days. We know that dancers are some of the greatest athletes around. Yet they have to mask that physicality in a perfect veneer. Cavaliers can't been seen grunting when lifting ballerinas. They can't have their tongue hang out (like basketball stars) when jumping. After a great variation, ballerinas can't lay back on the stage in triumph, the way winners of Wimbledon do. There's no grunting.

[Nanarina]

:ermm Dancers are simply not really allowed to show any effort, they must hold their mouth in a slightly open smile, and breath through the gap, when they are out of breath. On many occasions after say the Bluebird Pas de deux from Sleeping Beauty, I have had to open the back of the male dancers costume, so they can breath.
It is not unusual to find dancers laying flat on their backs in the wings to recover from an extra strenuious solo or vartiation. Without spoilling the illusion, of what you see from the audience, very often the dancers are running in persparation, their costumes covered in make up, and pretty near to exhausion. That is why the intervals are so necessary during a performance.

[Helene]

There was a program about Edward Villella that used to be available on VHS that showed just that. I saw it a long time ago, but the one thing that struck me most was the scene in which Villella came offstage after one of his riffs in "Rubies", fell to the floor in complete exhaustion, got up, and proceeded to dance the next section as softly as a cat.

[Alexandra]

Well, there are certain ballet "players" who might be better off trying soccer......

[bart]

As to how to deal with it, I think he should just be sent for a couple of ballet classes.

This might be a good idea, actually. I see it as a kind of "alternate sentencing." One proviso, however: they have to do this in private, with no reality-show tv cameras to allow them to get laughs. Then they have to write an essay -- which will be published -- describing just how difficult, serious, and (one hopes they see this) beneficial ballet can be. (IMG:http://ballettalk.invisionzone.com/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

I think I like the "ignore" option best -- possibly accompanied by a little bit of mime. Just look at them, tilt your head a little to the side quizzically, and then break out into a BIG smile ... and say: "What an ... interesting idea."

If you keep up the ballet and live long enough, you are guaranteed to be one of the only people in your generation who can walk straight, touch your toes without bending the knee, balance on one leg, and even turn a few leisurely pirouettes now and then. The scoffers, slumped in their recliner-chairs or on bar stools, will look at you with envy and respect.

[Ray]

Well, there are certain ballet "players" who might be better off trying soccer......

Certain ballet "coaches" too!

[papeetepatrick]

How do you suggest that a ballet-lover (or -- worse! -- a ballet dancer) respond to such a position? Reason? Rage? Sarcasm? Just ignoring it?

Not any response at all, unless 'just ignoring it' is the same thing as 'no response'. It wasn't directed at ballet lovers or ballet dancers, so it has no effect on them. That's normal macho talk in pro sports, I don't even object to it, why would I? Just because it's stupid and redneck doesn't quite make it 'hate speech'? It doesn't even exist! (IMG:http://ballettalk.invisionzone.com/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

[dirac]

It's the same sort of mentality that uses insults like, "You run like a girl" or "You do (some manly activity) like a girl."

Right. Ballet is perceived as unmanly not because it is seen as non-athletic or easy but because it is commonly identified with women, the inferior sex. It is something girls do. The qualities of ballet in the popular mind (in the US, anyway) – grace, beauty, delicacy, – are traditionally associated with femininity.

[diane]

The qualities of ballet in the popular mind (in the US, anyway) – grace, beauty, delicacy, – are traditionally associated with femininity.

-sigh-
Just as you have said; femininity = inferior.

What a strange notion, really.



-d-